Yerf Dog 3002 torque converter help

[Yerf Dogger]

Hello buggy master users! I am new to this site and am learning as i go.
So last summer (2011) i bought a used model 3002 Yerf Dog (as far as i can tell, it may be a 30033, but im pretty sure its a 3002) completely stock (also, as far as i can tell) anyway, when I bought this kart it was SLOW!! about 15 m.p.h. tops, every once in awhile it would "take off". so first i thought it was the carb (this has a 6hp techumseh power sport) so i bought a carb rebuild kit and installed it and have since had a few problems with the carb, my engine doesnt want to idle, ive messed with the idle screw and it will either stall if i turn it a little to the left to lower the idle, or if i turn it to the right to make the idle higher, it'll rev up enough to engage the torque converter, so i'm still not sure about that. After doing the carb rebuild it still wasnt very fast and would still "take off" every once in awhile. I finally realized it was the torque converter causing me all these problems. After doing some research on it i found out it was a Comet 30 series torque converter. After doing MORE research i found out about how to clean these things. So i took it all apart and cleaned out the driver and driven unit, put it all back together worked great for about 15min. then it was having "jerky" engagement and sometimes get stuck in "overdrive" and stall the engine, it would also not go fully into overdrive, and sometimes it wouldn't engage at all, even if the engine is fully revved. (this was about a month ago). Since then ive taken the driver unit apart about every weekend completely take it apart and cleaned it and get the same results!!!! So MORE research i found out that you have to make sure these units are aligned, so i checked it out on my kart, and they ARE aligned. Does anybody have any suggestions on how to get this system to work consistently, i dont know what else to do, besides buying a new torque converter set up (which i really dont want to so, since they are about $200 new). ANY IDEAS??? Any suggestions would be GREATLY appreciated!!!

[x-bird]

Is the brass bushing on the shaft of the driver in good condition or is it worn where it's showing a "ripply" looking surface? Other issue with it may be a worn spring. If you can, take and post some pictures front behind or over top the unit trying to show the alignment of the two pulleys as best as possible

[Yerf Dogger]

It appears to be in good condition, but I will try to post pictures as soon as I can. Is the spring you are talking about the spring on the driver or the green spring on the driven?

[x-bird]

green spring on the driven. also make sure the driven pulley halves are not loose at all on their hubs at the rivets. mine began cracking from the rivets outwards and shook like the little cymbals on a tambourine.

[Yerf Dogger]

Is there anything that you can think of that would prevent the driver unit from working properly? I'll have to check out the driven when I get home, but I think my problems are comming from the driven (the part on the engine shaft).

[metalstudman1]

Are the pins in the wieghts touching the inside lip of the clutch? these pins wear down. These are easy to replace and cheap(they pull out and tap back in with a knurled grip to hold them in place). A worn/narrow belt can cause all kinds of issues too, slow starts,jerking at throttle up, slower than normal top speed,locked up belt in the pulleys(roll-over) and good performance when cold then declines.

[Yerf Dogger]

Metalstudman1: I just replaced the belt, so it is in good condition. However, where are theses weights you are talking about suppose to be? Are they on the driven or driver unit?

[metalstudman1]

The quickest way I could get you to see the parts is from another current thread!!! http://www.buggymasters.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3018
3rd & 4th pic's. the 2 pins point out from the clutch weights to the inner lip of the clutch housing.

[Yerf Dogger]

Ahhh, NOW I see what your talking about!!! Ill have to check that out, so if they aren't touching the lip of the clutch they are worn down and need to be replaced?

[metalstudman1]

They should be almost touching.

[Yerf Dogger]

So I checked out the pins today and they ARE close to/touching the lip of the clutch. I took some pics today and am hoping to post them tomorrow afternoon, maybe you will be able to see something wrong that I'm not seeing. Thanks for your help so far!

[Yerf Dogger]

Ok, so i have some pics of the torque converter, but i cant figure out how to post them, can someone please help???

[Yerf Dogger]

Nevermind, got them uploaded!!!

Does anyone notice any problems???

On the driven unit i know i am missing a few of the black plastic tabs, other than that, i think everything is there.

[metalstudman1]

Clutch looks good- The belt looks way too loose. The driven unit helix should be against the rubber/plastic tips when at rest(the tips are very important). Did you try to apply a quarter turn/tension when re-assembling it? Is the spring seated in the adjustment holes? Your spring may be too soft to apply tension on the helix. In a perfect world the belt on the driven(when at rest)should be flush with the top of the sheaves/pulleys. Remove the belt and look at the shaft of the driven- are the rivets getting shiney? Can you turn the driven sheave/pulley by hand to make it open?

[Yerf Dogger]

I haven't been able to try turning the driven pulley by hand to make it open, but I recall I was able to make it open by hand. In terms of the belt, is there a size smaller? I think I got the smallest belt possible, but I'm not possative. In terms of the green spring in order to to make it have more tension, do I take the whole driven unit off and remove the lock ring and turn it a quarter turn? Or is there a different way?

[metalstudman1]

I can't really tell from the pic's if your driven jackshaft has a adjustable plate for tightening the belt. You have to remove the nut & snap ring on the driven to try and rotate the sheave/pulley for spring adjustment.

[Yerf Dogger]

My jackshaft does not have an adjustable plate to tighten the belt, the plate its mounted to it the same plate that the engine is mounted to. When doing the quarter turn to tighten the green spring, do you turn it a quarter turn to the left (counter clockwise) or to the right (clockwise)? Or does it not really matter if you turn it to the left or right?

[FloridaCracker]

I agree with the belt looking too loose. Can you move the motor forward and see if that helps?

[Yerf Dogger]

Unfortunately the way its set up, I can not, the plate that the jackshaft is connected to is the same plate that the motor is mounted to. In other words when you move the motor the jack shaft also moves so the distance between the driver and the driven unit is always the same. The only thing moving the motor does is tighten the chain.

[metalstudman1]

Have you tried the belt chart to verify that the belt you're using is correct?
http://www.*****************/tcbelts.htm

[Yerf Dogger]

Yea, I've used that chart, but ill take the measurments again and see if I do in fact have the wrong belt

[Yerf Dogger]

Ok, so i remeasured and the belt is the right belt (according to the chart) its Belt # 203591
and the driven unit is 7in. and the center distance is a little longer than what is says in the chart. So i think my problem is in the driver unit, i need to take it apart and turn the spring a quarter turn, also i ordered new rubber/plastic tips and they should come either tomorrow or early next week. Hopefully after I do all that I will see better results, ie, the belt will have more tension, i think the reason my belt is so loose is because the driven unit isn't pushing on the belt hard enough (the belt, like metalstudman1 said, isn't at the top of the sheaves/pulleys when at rest).

[x-bird]

I have the same belt on my 30 series tec/yerf setup and did both a 7 inch (original) and 6 inch driven. Your driver and driven look way too close to each other. double check your engine plate for adjustment. the frame plate should be slotted and i'm pretty sure that the jackshaft/engine plate is too. At least mine was. when i went to the 6 inch i actually separated the engine from the jackshaft by cutting and getting rid of the plate portion under the engine to get more adjustment. Others have run out of adjustment/alignment room with their stock components over time.

If yours is set up like mine was, you should have 2 jackshaft carriage bolts and four engine bolts. if so, both the chain tension and pulley distance should be adjustable.

Loosen all six fasteners to the point that there's a good 1/8th inch gap between the nut/washer on the underside and the underside of the frame plate. then try moving the engine away from the jackshaft.

the whole unit may be pushed to one end or the other of the frame slots making it seem like it's non adjustable. you may have to move both together to be able to get them into an adjustable "range" in the frame slots again.


as far as the driven goes. when you take the outer half off, the green spring has 3 holes for it's end to go into that set engagement "shift" tension. most prefer the factory setting of "2" When putting it back together, you have to put 1/3rd of a turn tighter into the spring (coils get closer--think its clockwise, not positive) and hold it there when getting it back on the jackshaft and tightened up. if you don't it may cause problems like your having as well.

[Newoldstock]

Originally Posted by x-bird

Is the brass bushing on the shaft of the driver in good condition or is it worn where it's showing a "ripply" looking surface? Other issue with it may be a worn spring. If you can, take and post some pictures front behind or over top the unit trying to show the alignment of the two pulleys as best as possible

I'm having some of these troubles too on my 165 using this clutch kit off the dog.

But I have worn out a belt in under 45 minuts and dimpled the bushing as discribed here.

[ELIPHAZ]

Originally Posted by metalstudman1

Are the pins in the wieghts touching the inside lip of the clutch? these pins wear down. These are easy to replace and cheap(they pull out and tap back in with a knurled grip to hold them in place). A worn/narrow belt can cause all kinds of issues too, slow starts,jerking at throttle up, slower than normal top speed,locked up belt in the pulleys(roll-over) and good performance when cold then declines.

Do you know where to obtain these pins?

Thanks.

[Yerf Dogger]

http://www.*****************/asymapp.htm
I've used this website for parts before, they are pretty reliable. However they dont sell just the pins, you have to buy the Spring & Flyweight Assembly for Driver Clutch as a whole, let me know if you find a website that sells just the pins.